14 comments on “Scottish & Welsh LIB DEMs, hate England as a national entity!

  1. Sour grapes much? Not sure the denigration of Cornwall’s proud history and indeed identity itself will do much for your electoral prospects. How can you deride the Scots and Welsh for interfering in this when you are not Cornish or even live in Cornwall? Or is it English Democrats policy to have a say on everything outside of England and not accept the same in return?

    • No sour grapes, merely questioning the vague claims to uniqueness and desire for special status. More like touchiness on your part which is customary whenever dubious claims are questioned.

      What exactly is Cornwall’s “proud history”? I think we should be told.

      As I recorded, the territory we now call Cornwall was part of Dumnonia or do you dispute this? It has been part of England for over 1,000 years; do you dispute this also?

      I think this more than adequately accounts for our interest, but I think you are unable to dispute it, and so resort to making unsupported assertions. Moreover, we believe in majority interests, and so called Cornish nationalists are a small, unrepresentative minority.

      We are certainly at liberty to have a say about the tawdry deal done with the Lib Dems in Coalition in which your non-participation in these elections was bought by offering ‘special status’. Don’t delude yourself that this is a one-off matter . . . in future elections, we shall remind voters in Cornwall of Mebyon Kernow’s ‘short-termism’ repeatedly. For your part, you can swear at us in your Cornish lingo! ENJOY!

      • So explain the logic to me, Cornwall is not a nation and can’t claim a proud history as you put it because it was conquered by England. So being entwined with another nation renders identity obsolete, how does this then apply to England and the English. Does it follow that that identity ceased to exist when Cornwall was annexed or Wales or Scotland? Or did the idea of England cease to exist with the Norman conquest? Might we render Englishness obselete and argue for union with France? Of course not. I don’t doubt the existence of the Cornish nation any more I do the English nation. This is a reality I accept. Why can’t people like yourself accept the reality if Cornwall’s existence?

      • Just who are the Cornish, as distinct from the English? Evidence please!

      • I notice how you didn’t explain the contradiction between nations no longer apparently existing when political union happens. Nevermind.

        Surely the evidence is the recognition as the Cornish as a nation in the Framework Convention. But if you want a meatier answer here’s the report commissioned by Cornwall Council and signed by all the political groups on at that time (pdf) which explains how Cornwall is different
        https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&ei=quReU5TWI4jYOdixgdgP&url=http://www.gorsethkernow.org.uk/english/downloads/cornish_minority_report_2.pdf&cd=2&ved=0CC0QFjAB&usg=AFQjCNFQ0H5z8KFWtpqaLRlzosLr4iVZDA&sig2=rXAHmGavkeMDfIkEca1Xsw

      • A nation cannot exist without is people. Accordingly, I ask once again:

        Just who are the Cornish, as distinct from the English? Evidence please!

        I believe that you are unable to answer this question convincing, and so, resort to questions which assume the existence of a ‘cornish nation’.

    • Apologies I thought you might have read the link I provided.
      First self identification as a nation many in Cornwall (census Plasc survey) view their identity as Cornish rather than English or British.
      Second Cornwall has an identity, culture, customs, flag and language that are distinct from English equivalents.
      Third Cornwall has a separate history to England. Although intertwined the history of Cornwall doesn’t fit in well with English history. Both as descending from the native Celtic Britons rather than immigrant Anglo Saxon English. And as history continued with the English expanding and the English language being forced onto Cornwall.

      You may not like these facts and prefer a world where everyone wants to be English. But do you ever consider that Cornish nationhood need not be a threat to yourself and rather than fear it you should embrace it?

      • You need to learn that opinions are not facts.

        Here is your first generalisation reflected back at you:
        First self identification as a nation many [nay, MOST!] in Cornwall (census Plasc survey) view their identity as English rather than Cornish or British.

        To assert: “Second Cornwall has an identity, culture, customs, flag and language that are distinct from English equivalents.” is solely that: mere unsupported assertion.

        I could go on, but you all you can do is sloganise without any facts.

        I note that you are unable to say just who are the Cornish, as distinct from the English or to supply any objective evidence!

        Self-certification was a contributory factor in the recent financial crisis caused by vast amounts of toxic debt!

        You are so self-absorbed that you never campaigned for a separate tick box for English ethnic identity, but sufficiently hypocritical that you contrive to differentiate yourself from the English rather than the British who are recorded.

    • I underestimated you Alan that non sequitur at the end about the financial crash is priceless, great to finally see some humour.

      Not sure how you equate things like flags, history, culture, language etc as opnions. By any definition they are facts. Take it you still haven’t read that link, so I won’t bother linking the PLASC numbers. That was my argument that the Cornish are different to the English your opinion can ignore this if you will but the fact is many don’t.

      You’re right about one thing I never did campaign for an English tick box. Would kinda be pointless as there was one! Not sure I follow your logic there, perhaps a cultural thing? 😉

      • It would appear that I have over estimated you Mr Kernow. Yes, you might want to regard my reference to the financial crash as a non sequitur, but it was intended to be what we English call an analogy. Of course, like most analogies it relies upon a shared knowledge; in this case awareness that the origin of much toxic [ie bad] debt incurred by the ‘Celtic’ Scottish RBS & BoS bankers in Edinburgh was the practice of permitting borrowers to ‘self-certify’ ~ geddit?

        You cling to self-certification like chewing gum to a shoe sole. [This is more in the way of what we English call a simile.]

        The problem with self-certification is that it is infinite. For example, you could self-certify as being Martian or, at a push, even English. There is provision for us to self-certify as being non compos mentis and admit ourselves to medical care. Sorry to bat on so much about self-certification but you introduced the subject, you rely almost entirely upon it, but give not the slightest indication of comprehending how really risible it really can be!

        Now, do try to concentrate your mind and tell us exactly, definitively, who are the Cornish, as distinct from the English? In my not so humble opinion you cannot do so and therefore you attempt to divert attention to heavily skewed reports which draw preconceived conclusions on scant evidence, plus self-certification.

        For the record, I do not equate inanimate objects as opinions, neither do I confuse opinions based on facts as facts. Here is an Oxford English Dictionary definition of ‘fact’:
        “Something that has really occurred or is actually the case; something certainly known to be of this character; hence a particular truth known by actual observation or authentic testimony, as opposed to what is merely inferred, or to a conjecture or fiction; a datum of experience, as opposed to the conclusions which may be based upon it.”
        Perhaps you have another definition in your ‘Cornish’ lexicon?

        You expose your limitations with your ignorant remarks; “You’re right about one thing I never did campaign for an English tick box. Would kinda be pointless as there was one! Not sure I follow your logic there, perhaps a cultural thing?”

        As with too many, you appear to confuse ‘nationality’ (or ‘national identity’) with ‘ethnicity’ (or to use Census terminology, ‘ethnic identity’) Whilst the 2011 Census did include ‘England’ in the question (15.) “How would you describe your national identity?”, it did not include a separate tick box for ‘English’ in Question 16 “What is your ethnic group?” For someone who appears so keen to claim differences of culture and language and celticism (ie ethnicity), you seem to bob around from one expediency to another!

        Increasingly, it seems to me, so called Celts are exclusive and selfishly demand special status and special treatment. You remind me of the Nazis and their ‘pure aryan’ claims. You are not oppressed as a group if only because you are not visible as a distinct group, nor can you even define who you are being reliant on self-certification (or self-identification, if you prefer). You are being used by Scots and Welsh to create division in England.

        You do not occupy the high moral ground if only because your position is unrepresentative, self-seeking, divisive and destructive. If Scotland votes ‘Yes’ in its selfish, exclusive little referendum (and I fervently hope that they convincingly do!), your position will become more interesting, quite simply because a territorial matter in England will no longer be of any proper concern of theirs, especially when one considers that some 90% of its half a million inhabitants do not regard themselves as Cornish but merely English folk living and working in Cornwall.

        You may adopt a faux pose of superiority here, but your comments will be viewed by the vast preponderance of English people as being inappropriate (this being an English nationalist blog), insolent and impertinent. Now go away and see if you can cadge [good old English word this!] some more English money from your celtic friends.

    • No, widespread awareness of their hostility and the divisions they cause should be sufficient.

      The one thing they fear is our majority vote, if we can muster it!

      • You should beware of leading with your chin Cernow. [Celtic spelling!]

        Given that Mebyon Kernow were bribed by the Lib Dems in the British Government to stand aside, our 1,323 votes were 1,323 more than was needed to ‘quash’ you moral cowards.

        How ironic that, despite this skullduggery, the Lib Dems in the south west of ENGLAND failed to keep a seat in the EU Parliament.

        Enjoy your schadenfreude! We’ll keep reminding voters of your sell-out!

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